Original comment by pelegray from my "Long Overdue" (27 Apr) post: "Didnt u say the other nite u thought the Nugz would win the series over SA???? See and then you hop back and forth with, that was my fan side, this is my rational side. And your love of cheering for the Rockies, you might as well be a Cubs fan too. Rational fans cheer for goods teams, irrational fans hope and pray, but don't use your "objective side." So are you a fan, or an objectional veiwer. I think playing both sides of the coin is worse then choosing a couple of teams you like. Besides you cheer for teams, which is a colection of player, and players change so sticking with CO teams just doesn't make since. If it is state pride your after your mistaken, their privatly owned, most likely by people outside of CO."
*NOTE: The second half of this post deals with Blake's claim that it's better to value the individual and not the whole (I know that may be better in dealing with capitalism vs. communism, but the Cold War is over buddy). If you don't feel like reading all of it, I've moved a link I talk about below to the top for the sake of convenience. It's from Dan Findlay's blog after UNC won the NCAA Championship. Click Here to read it and skip all of my boring blabbing.
Firstly, I would like to begin by expressing my anger. I had a long response typed under my "comments" box in the original post, but because of it's length I decided to turn it into it's own post. However, in copying and pasting it over somehow the comment became lost in the exchange and I'm forced to try to recreate what I already had (that's like trying to reinact anything MJ ever did, the feeling when one of your teams wins a championship [think Avalanche Stanley Cup here], any Duke loss ever, or that feeling I'll probably have when I become a dad someday: it's just not happening.). Anyway, here is my best attempt.
Chops (pelegray), I must first say that no, I never said I thought they would win, instead that I thought they could and wanted them to. Next, I must assume that (based off of your comment) you know between nothing and absolutely nothing about being a fan and also being a rational, functional human being capable of interaction with other human beings of such likeness. Now, I'm not saying you can't be one or the other at any given time, but after that comment I am convinced that there is no way you can be both at the same time.
You know "that guy" - the one who loves his team and will yell about them all night long, but then does the whole proverbial "cover your ears and start screaming 'la la la la la' when anyone tries to have an actual discussion of any sort of merit about 'that guy's' team?" Well, I know two of those guys (Kellen Gustavson, Mike Pacini: UNC basketball), and they drive me absolutely crazy in this regard. See, I'm all about being a fan. As a fan, I hope the Nuggets beat SA 4-0, Phoenix 4-0, Seattle 4-0, and Miami/Detroit 4-0 en route to Denver's first professional basketball championship. Do you know what else I want? I want the Rockies to go 162-0, beat the Braves 3-0, the Cardinals 4-0, and the Yankees 4-0 to win the World Series. (We're not done yet.) I want the Broncos to go 16-0, then steamroll their way through the playoffs and win the Super Bowl for the third time. (One more still Chops). Finally, I want the NHL to come back so the Avalanche can go 82-0 before completing Lord Stanley's quest 16-0 and bring back the Cup for a third time. And those are just my pro teams....
Do you see how unreasonable that is? Now add in that annoyance factor where everytime you criticize or bring up a weak point or fault in my team, I just plug my ears and don't listen; you would get pretty annoyed and think I wasn't reasonable right? Which is why I like to separate the two. I have always had a thing for sports journalism (see my role on my high school newspaper to know this isn't just some out-of-left-field comment) and I've always had a thing about being a fan, I just like to do my best to keep them separate. See, I wanted UA to win the National Championship and picked them to do so in every single bracket I filled out, but I also talked with others about not feeling like UA was quite good enough to be championship caliber and hoped that they would at least get to the Final Four (didn't happen). With my two aforementioned UNC buddies (note the satire), this conversation would have never been possible. You see, according to them, the last two years UNC has had the best basketball team the world has ever seen. Granted, they did win the National Championship, but this started WAY before that (and to be fair: I gave them the props they deserved on 04 April). Every single loss had a tired excuse, every comment (aka "I'm in jail") was unfairly spun by the media, every clock malfunction (even the one in the Michigan St.-Duke game) was somehow an effort to let Duke win and have UNC lose. Even the second round loss to Texas last year was somehow a good showing by UNC, despite the fact that I was told all year UNC could and would be anyone. You see Chops, I have no problem with people being fans and cheering and hoping your team will do anything you want it to do, but I do have a problem with unreasonable people that think if they yell loud enough or act naive enough then they will be "right." I could go on longer but I don't want this to turn from a weblog to a webnovel (bnovel doesn't have the same ring as blog anyway).
As for your "rational fans cheer for good teams," I hope so much that that was a failed attempt at humor and nothing more.
Also, I'm not "playing both sides of the coin." All year I thought New England was good enough to beat Indy (and predicted it as well), and as a fan of cheering against Peyton, I was firmly on the NE side of things back in January (Want proof? Ask anyone that knows me even a little bit.) Sometimes my objective side lines up with my subjective side, sometimes not: it's all in how the cookie crumbles.
Finally, your comment about cheering for teams versus cheering for individuals is quite possibly the worst statement I've ever heard from anyone regarding anything that is sport (including what I've heard from girls). Have you ever heard of a thing called pride? Not that negative hubris pride but that "I live in America so I'm going to support my country and my troops" sort of pride. You pick an entity and follow it because of pride Blake. This pride can come from anywhere (parents, alma-matter, living in the state, someone you know socialized you, etc.), but the fact remains that it must be there. There is one person I have ever cheered for (MJ), everything else has been T-E-A-M.
(I honestly feel like I'm at a loss for words on how to describe this; it's like having a little kid tell you that he doesn't believe grass is green and trying to prove to him that it is.)
Of course I cheer for teams Blake, because I'm a fan of the whole being bigger than any one piece. Jack Parkman might get traded to the White Sox, but you know that unless Rachel Phelps gets her way the Indians will always be from Cleveland (and Cleveland [NFL] and Charlotte [NBA] proved you can get them back if you care anyway). John Elway might play 16 years and have a great career, but it's awesome to know that the Broncos will go on, even when he doesn't. Cheering for a team unites one with another. Go to any game in person to see what I mean (especially if it's a big one); you'll probably end up high-fiving and/or hugging a complete stranger. Being a fan of the whole also gives a sense of belonging, almost like you are interwoven with the organization, an actual part of the whole (something which cannot be felt by idolizing a mere individual). It makes you feel like you actually are a part of the team, like your being a fan might actually have made some sort of difference. This may sound weak in print but emotions were never meant to be read anyway, there are words for that; emotions are to be felt.
I may want to play like A-Rod, but I don't want to cheer for the M's for a few years, then the Rangers, and now the Yankees (although I do remember you saying you're a Yankees fan, so this all is making at least a little more sense to me now....). Nobody likes someone that jumps ship. People like something they can depend on to be the same now and always. The bad times suck (see my life as a Rockies fan), but the good times are amazing (Click Here to see how it feels when your TEAM finally comes out on top). In fact, I'm moving that link to the top of this post, and with it I shall be done.
--END--
17 comments:
You might notice I didn't address all that Chops mentioned in his comment. Some of it was so frivolous that it was beyond even a word. Anything else, well, imagine dropping a bag of sand and trying to pick up each individual grain and you'll know how I felt when I was trying to respond.
Dude, I know Dan's blog is a great one and all that.....by u need to start quoting or linking someone else's man. This is getting comical...you quote findlay's blog every second you can. This is your blog...Not the genius'. This is so un-dude...if you get what i am saying
I pay him to do it.
With money.
Hey Brandon, do me a favor and start a blog of your own then so I can link that one also. I link his blog only when pertinent, and that post came to mind because it perfectly showed what it means to be a fan of the team and not an individual. Find me some other links and I'll be happy to post, but I read them and they work. And for the record, that was the second link/mention of his blog (pretty excessive, I know). And I've linked to all over (another blog for the Manning issue, ESPN.com, etc.).
And the money's great.
Don't worry Prince, you can still be one of my groupies.
By the way, TWSHIT comment Prince.
hey everyone...go to this site..im linking it to Bernal's site and doing him a favor---dont worry, it isn't porn. http://theforce.net/fanfilms/nonsw/grayson/
IT TAKES A WHILE..but its worth it
Tell me if u think this can be a real movie...i think it has potential...By the way chris...yes it was two times...but in the same posting?? Im saving you from this slippery slope you are on...but i aint starting my own blog..i just chip in with "piffy comments" and correct people.. CALL ME STAT-BOY!!!- that is, before he hosted Around the Horn!!!
Reali always was a good b**** to Kornheiser and Wilbon, so I think that is a good title for you.
I posted it twice for a reason. After I wrote the whole thing I thought that some people might not want to read my LLLLOOOONNNNGGG post and could instead just click the link at the top if they wanted to bypass the whole thing. I still left the original link in there so those that waded through the minutia could know when to go there as well.
And slippery slope? You sound like Cuomo.
Chris..just remember this..i keep my friends close...but my enemies closer
Haha Chris. I didn't read it either. But I would like to say that your response and time wasted added a little bit of pleasure to my arguementative ways. Look, just cause I'm from Arizona doesn't mean I am a "fan" of Arizona Busnisses. Nor do I think that all politicians from Arizona are good either. I wouldn't cheer for Mike Tyson either, even though he does live here occasionally. It doesn't matter that much. My arguement against you was largely based on rational vs. irrational fan basis. Rational, according to dictionary.com is, "Consistent with or based on reason; logical: rational behavior" My arguement is that it is far less rational to say I cheer for all teams the come from towns that start with the letter M! or to cheer for all teams from a state. then to say, I look at team and cheer for ones I respect. get it! good!
end.
You are a sorry excuse for a fan. There is no way I can even try to enlighten you here.
You cannot argue with ignorance.
good arguement.....
Who is the bigger fool: the fool himself or he that argues with him?
haha, you just ade my point. Your so stupid for getting so into that arguement that night. I didn't care I was laughing. thanks Obi Wan, thanks for the wisdom.
Who just made who's point:
"Your so stupid for getting so into that arguement [sic] that night."
I'm sorry I care about something. I know it's pretty terrible to be passionate about something, especially something as trivial as sports. What is pride and loyalty these days anyway?
As for your bandwagon jumping, I offer you this:
Chinese Proverb: A wise man makes his own decisions, an ignorant man follows the public opinion.
And as for my comment about what it means to get into an argument with a fool:
Afghan Proverb: The right answer to a fool is silence.
Not at all, it was a postscript if you will. Read the blog and then the comment and you will see it makes sense.
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